Enter your debit card number so that we can check that it's one we accept, then - if you have more than one plan on your account - choose one of the options: NOTE: Always make sure that you pay your minimum payment against Normal Credit before making payments against any other plans or you may incur late fees and more interest. You will then be asked to pay a monthly minimum payment and you will be charged interest every month. Do you have any information regarding this credit card charge? It also prevents Persistent Debt from becoming a long-term problem for you. Why is it important that I take action? Any of these: till/kiosk receipt; confirmation email; e-receipt ; your order number; If you can't find one of the above, don't worry. Looks from the OP like a case of been there, done that, and even got the T shirt to prove it. Capita. Please don't put it off, it really is easier to deal with if you change your payment habits as quickly as possible. The customer reviews programme for the Argos Card is a separate activity from the rest of the product reviews programme. I've recently changed my name. Get reviews and contact details for each business including phone number, postcode, opening hours and photos. Can I repay more than my Direct Debit each month? Why are you increasing the interest rate on my account? Only the main Card holder can register on myargoscard.co.uk - so if you've been given your Card by someone else then you won't be able to register on this website or the App. Go to, Provides free, confidential debt advice in each council area throughout Northern Ireland via an online chat service and by phone. Find out more about Persistent Debt here. How do I know my online order has actually gone through? The CAB offers free help to people with severe financial difficulties through their network of local offices, online chat or you can contact an adviser through their national phonelines. If you want to set one up or amend an existing Direct Debit log into this website or call us on 03456 400 700. You can look on your latest statement (go to View Statements when you log in) or we'll tell you on your Account Summary. Cement Plants. Paying by HIGH STREET BANK, BUILDING SOCIETY or POST OFFICE Please allow 5 working days for payments to reach your account. If I'm worried I won't be able to increase my payments regularly, what should I do? More for ARGOS LIMITED (01081551) Registered office address Avebury, 489-499 Avebury Boulevard, Milton Keynes, United Kingdom, MK9 2NW . If you already have Adobe Reader or equivalent, make sure your PDF software is up-to-date. Argos Limited has been running for 50 years. due by 15 February 2023, 47190 - Other retail sale in non-specialised stores, 47540 - Retail sale of electrical household appliances in specialised stores, 47599 - Retail of furniture, lighting, and similar (not musical instruments or scores) in specialised store, Companies House does not verify the accuracy of the information filed, 13 Nov 1972 - The credit card charge ARGOS RETAIL GROUP INTERNET GB was first recorded on April 05, 2015. I turned off paper statements but I've started receiving them again. I've sent a text to opt out of the interest rate increase and received an error message. Why am I asked to call you when I try to log in? I've received a letter from you that says my account could be suspended. You can change your Login ID later if you want to. If you see a strange transaction on your statement, dont panic but do let us know about it as soon as possible, so we can check its not fraudulent. No - for security reasons, we ask you to register for both separately. How can I see if I have a Direct Debit set up? Write to us: You can write to us at Home Retail Group Card Services Ltd, PO Box 211, Park Mill, Huddersfield, HD8 1FA. Please take a look at our dedicated help page for more information. Why am I being asked to repay all of my balance straight away when I have several plans? Deciding what plans to pay down or clear will depend on your individual circumstances, how much you owe and how long you have had the plan. (Employees figure is estimated). Does anyone know that 'Widnes' is. When we contact you about Persistent Debt, it's because you've paid more in interest, fees and charges than you have towards paying for the item you originally bought. Argos is my go to for all household goods. So Visa Debit, MasterCard Debit and Maestro are accepted methods of payment but AmEx and MasterCard or Visa Credit are not. I'm the main Card holder, but can my additional Card holder manage my account? When you get in touch with us, we will make a note of which option you've chosen and monitor your account to make sure that you're paying what you need to. Under the new rules, you have 18 months from receiving the first letter to move your account out of Persistent Debt. When can I use my new credit limit? If you wish to make a complaint you can do so by making contact through any of the channels listed here: We hope to resolve issues as soon as were informed. PS. How long will it take for my card to be blocked from spending? This website will work on all commonly used browsers - Chrome, Microsoft Edge, Safari, Firefox - and on most devices (PCs, iMacs and Macbooks, iPhones, iPads, Android phone and Android tablets, Amazon Fire tablets). Can I pay off my Argos Card balance faster? Here are a few reasons why you might not be able to update your limit: How do I increase my credit limit? What's my Memorable Word and my Security Number? I've been in contact with you and chosen an option, but my circumstances have changed. Will I need my login details to make purchases or manage my account over the phone? How will I know when my Argos Card account is, My Buy Now Pay Later Plan ends soon, and I don't know how I'm going to afford to pay off the balance. It's shown on the front of your statement each month. Call your bank and ask for the authorisation code, call back argos with that to their accounts team and should be sorted. You must pay your minimum payment before the due date each month, which will be at least 25 days after your statement date. } If you want to change your Direct Debit amount or change the date on which you want your Direct Debit to be collected you'll need to give us a call on 03456 400 700. Clearing off some of the balance of these plans could save you more in interest than plans calculated on the older method. You can change your cookie settings at any time. } I've sent a text to opt out of the interest rate increase, but I haven't had a response. Confirmation statement. What do I do? You can change your bank details here online. .tg .tg-f6w8 { Investors. Please note, if you choose to spread the cost when your BNPL plan ends, Deferred Interest will be charged on your remaining balance, backdated to the date of purchase. Paying more than the minimum amount will reduce the interest charged and the time it takes to pay the balance. If you set up a direct debit up in the past but have not made any payments within 12 months we may need to set this up again. This useful guide from UK Finance offers further help and advice. Also, we'll advise you where to find free and independent help. My Buy Now Pay Later Plan ends soon, and I dont know how Im going to afford to pay off the balance. Argos Limited, trading as Argos, is a catalogue retailer operating in the United Kingdom and Ireland, acquired by Sainsbury's supermarket chain in 2016. How do I know my online order has actually gone through? reasonable costs for enforcing the agreement, including any loss, costs or expenses that may be incurred in collecting money owed under this agreement; It's the amount of interest that you could be charged if you don't pay off the full Buy Now, Pay Later plan balance before the plan ends. Can I register an expired Argos Card so that I can still manage my account? Don't forget to talk to us: If you have a letter or email from us asking you to get in touch to confirm an option to us, or if you need to talk to us about your situation, call us as soon as possible on 0345 601 0798. If you don't have sufficient funds in your account, then your Direct Debit might fail. Noticed this morning that a card payment I made in Argos on Friday has come out again today, just rang Natwest who have said that Argos have been experiencing problems and there have been numerous calls today from customers stating that money has come out of their account twice. If you don't pay in full in this time, you'll be charged interest. AGM 2022. Can I cancel my Direct Debit? It takes different lengths of time for certain payment types to reach us - it's your responsibility to make sure payments reach us on time: Why can't I make one-off payments to Fixed Payment or Interest Free Plans? NOTE: These are your login details for this website, NOT argos.co.uk. Can I turn off my paper statements and letters? }. If you're on an Android device, make sure you have a suitable app for opening PDFs. The credit card charge "ARGOS RETAIL GROUP INTERNET GB" was first recorded on April 05, 2015. Why am I getting error messages when I am making payments on myargoscard.co.uk? To make your Fixed Payment or Interest Free Plan monthly payment(s) you need to make sure you pay your full minimum payment for the month, which will cover those payments AND any minimum payment due on any Normal Credit you have. No, you need to let us know that you want to do this via text message or by calling our dedicated helpline. Confirmation statement. Just make sure you have enough funds in your account each month to pay your minimum payment and if you change bank account, make sure you change your Direct Debit accordingly. This does not prevent you from settling your balance early should you wish to. Make sure you're entering your most up-to-date Argos Card - if you have received a new Argos Card recently, you'll need to enter the details for that Card. Why am I being told that my details can't be found when I'm trying to register? Persistent Debt is where a customer has paid more in interest, fees and charges in an 18 month period, than they have towards paying for the item they originally bought. You can't make payments to plans that haven't appeared on your statement yet - if you try to do that our system will automatically allocate your payment to the plan or plans which are likely to incur the most interest that month. Where (i) to (v) are at the same rate of interest, balances will be paid off in the following order: (i) Interest; and then (ii) Charges and/or fees; and then (iii) Outstanding balance of Normal Credit including any missed scheduled Fixed Payment Plan(s) and Interest Free Plan(s) monthly scheduled instalments; and then (iv) Any outstanding balances on the other Payment Plans in the order of Buy Now Pay Later Plan(s), Fixed Payment Plan(s) and any Interest Free Plan(s); and then (v) Any other amounts that have been added to your account since the previous statement date. This website is run by Argos Limited. If you want to check your statement urgently, you can do it on myargoscard.co.uk where we have your current and most recent statements. (Please ensure that you provide all of your details relevant to your Argos Card account). A bank statement is a list of all transactions for a bank account over a set period, usually monthly / year. Our website contains the biggest collection of editable bank statement templates available online! How quickly is it set up? If you pay off some of the balance during the plan, you'll see on your subsequent statements that the Potential Deferred Interest reduces. Buy Video Games , Nursery , DIY equipment or Homewares in the Irish Argos catalogue. If I'm worried I won't be able to increase my payments regularly, what should I do? Have I done anything wrong if I receive a letter about Persistent Debt? Upcoming industrial action by Royal Mail may cause delays to postal communications. Scam App do not use! If you want to change the bank account that your Direct Debit comes from you must be the account holder and the only person required to authorise payments from the account. By Phone: If youd prefer to speak to someone you can contact us on 03456 400 700. Interest is calculated based on the amount outstanding at the end of the plan from the date you took it out. jhsam wrote: . How do I make a complaint? For any other changes (name, amount, date) you'll need to call us. No interest is charged if you pay in full before the end of the Pay Later period and keep your account up to date. What do I do if I'm struggling to pay my bills? The four digit Plan Ref simply helps us locate a plan on your account if you call us. Why am I asked to call you when I try to log in? . What do I do if I've lost my Argos Card or had it stolen? As long as your account is open, you haven't spent all of your credit limit and your account is not suspended, you can carry on using it. When your Direct Debit has been set up you will see this confirmed on your statement. However, if we do need to contact you we will ask some security questions before we can access your account. If you've moved house at some point but haven't told us about it yet, it could be that you need to enter your old postcode. What does this mean? Help others avoid a potential confusion by commenting! Find out more about Deferred Interest here. ~ Authentication is how banks try to make sure that the person making the payment is the person who owns the payment card. Cookies on Companies House services. What is Estimated Interest? Double check the message you've sent to make sure it matches the instructions we've given you, as the system we use can't register your request properly if there's things like spelling mistakes or if you've typed the wrong number. Privacy hub|Privacy policy|Cookies policy|List of cookies|Cookie preferences|Terms & conditions. We haven't increased the interest rate on the Argos Card for a long time, yet we have seen the costs of running the Argos Card increase. harris county toll r houston ref# www.hctra.org. your email address). Just log in and press Direct Debit in the left-hand navigation, then press Cancel Direct Debit. Why are you increasing the interest rate on my account? If you need a VAT receipt, contact our helpful Customer Services team. This would mean you will pay no interest at all. Any help would be appreciated. Find Argos Ltd near South Bank, Middlesbrough on Yell. If you make only the Minimum Payment each month it'll take you longer and cost you more to clear your balance so feel free to repay as much as you want to in addition to your Minimum Payment Direct Debit. If you are experiencing financial difficulties or can no longer afford to make your increased monthly payment, please contact us on 0345 601 0798 so that we can help you. Why is that? bank statement; or you could always give your order number if you have it handy; Ooh, and don't forget we offer e-receipts too. How can I get help with paying my Normal Credit balance? Easy to order and collect, really helpful for returns and refunds and great service for cancelling a large piece of furniture as well as very convenient for timely deliveries. The SNB kept its policy rate locked at -0.75%, as unanimously forecast by economists in a Reuters poll, as well as a commitment to conduct currency a study of the various performance management systems adopted by select indian private sector . How do I contact you? You might notice that some Plan Refs are the same as others - that's because they're not unique and they just tell us what type of plan it is. Were sorry to hear youre having issues with your Argos Card. Argos Limited is authorised and regulated by the Financial Conduct Authority as a credit broker (713206) and works exclusively with the lender, Home Retail Group Card Services Limited . How secure is this website? Innovation; Innovation; Argos Innovation Center; Projects; National help line and fax; USA: 1(888)567 66 29 Colombia: 01 8000 522021 Why won't my statement open? Can I make a payment using my own online banking? Logon ID Login ID * Your Login ID is at least 6 characters and can contain letters, numbers or special characters. Why can't I make one-off payments to Fixed Payment or Interest Free plans? If you've entered your login details incorrectly three times then your myargoscard.co.uk account will be locked for 30 minutes, at which point you can try to log in again. Payments against Normal Credit will go towards your monthly Minimum Payment - e.g. Check that you have no security software running that might be blocking the PDF from downloading. If you've only become an Argos Card holder in the past 12 months, If you have an emergency temporary credit limit already on your account, If you've changed your limit within the last 6 months, If you're requesting a new limit which is below your current balance, If you're in arrears or you've missed payments. The Potential Deferred Interest will be shown as soon as your plan appears on your Statement. by | May 23, 2022 | most charitable crossword | May 23, 2022 | most charitable crossword You should receive your statement within 10 days of your statement being printed. Shows transaction details for the statement period requested by the customer. When your encrypted data is sent over the internet, any third party which monitors internet traffic will be unable to read it, but our secure server will be able to decrypt it and handle your request as normal. We are committed to resolving your complaint to your satisfaction and hope that together we can reach an agreement. Your browser is up-to-date. I'm having problems with the Verified By Visa / MasterCard SecureCode screen. .tg TD { We want to help you, so please contact us on 0345 601 0798 if you want to talk about Persistent Debt. You can - if you want to use your own bank to make a payment here's what you need. Argos is currently taking money from customers without goods available. Your Security Number is a bit like a passcode - but unlike the passcode you might use for an App or your phone, this one is five digits long (and it's not the same as your My Argos Card App passcode. Can I opt out of the interest rate increase and close my account on MyArgosCard.co.uk or by using the App? Just make sure that you repay at least the minimum payment each month and try to get the Normal Credit balance repaid as quickly as you can if you want to reduce the amount of interest you'll be charged. I've forgotten my login details. If you remember your Login ID but you've forgotten your Memorable Word or Security Number, log in as normal (enter Login ID & Surname and press Next) but on the second page press Forgotten Your Security Details and follow the instructions. If you've only recently opened your account then it's possible you may not have a statement yet. . How Deferred Interest is included as part of your Minimum Payment?'). Your APR is displayed on your latest statement. If you want to change your payment due date, give us a call and ask. What's Normal Credit? Just remember, if you do spend more, your minimum payment will increase and it will take you longer to repay the balance. It shouldn't take more than a minute or two. If you go over your credit limit you may be charged a 12 fee which is detailed in your terms and conditions. Get reviews and contact details for each business including phone number, postcode, opening hours and photos. We encourage all our customers to pay more than the minimum payment, as this will help you repay your balance faster and pay less interest. You can use your Argos Card in any Argos store, online at argos.co.uk, over the phone and on the Argos app. You need to continue to make payments manually, until you see confirmation on your statement. Usually things get back to normal quickly but sometimes the situation can get worse and positive action is required - the remedies are often simple. 9.2K Posts. The chain sells more than 60,000 products, including top brands like Bose, Beats, Dyson, LEGO, Nespresso and Samsung, and exclusive lines like Chad . In the App you can view each of your plans in the My Credit Plans section, this will show you the purchase date, the purchase value and the outstanding balance. I've received a letter from you that says my account could be suspended. You'll need to send us one of the following documents (or a copy of the document) with a covering letter that includes your account number and address: Send your documents to: Argos Financial Services, PO Box 211, Park Mill, Huddersfield, HD8 1FA. Remember: If you continuously only make the minimum monthly contractual payment every month, it will take you longer and cost you more to clear your balance. If it's not on your statement then it's not set up, and if you don't make your payment then you may incur fees and more interest. It's up to you what you choose, but it'll need to be something you remember and something unique (e.g. The new processes have been agreed and implemented by all banks to help protect their customers from online fraud. Can I make a payment using my own online banking? Give us a call on 0345 640 0700 to discuss this in confidence. confusion by commenting! Your additional Card holder cannot register their Card on either myargoscard.co.uk OR on the My Argos Card App. So next time you buy something in-store, just ask for one and you'll never lose your receipt again. if you had a minimum payment due of 25, you would need to make a payment to Normal Credit of 25. We will communicate to you to let you know when you may be able to contact the Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS) to review your complaint. Find out more about Persistent Debt here. What should I do to ensure I don't pay more interest than I need to? How do I update my account? It is for 20. After you get your confirmation message, it can take some time for your card to be blocked while we process your request and make the changes we need to in our system. And your priority payments - Rent/mortgage, Council Tax, and household bills, will always come first. You're not tied in to paying a higher amount all the time. It is on a card that I don't really use and I can't remember if I bought anything for 20 that day. It's important because if you don't, it'll take you longer to repay the debt and you'll be charged more interest during that period. I don't think I'm in Persistent Debt. What happens if I am unable to increase my payments? REMEMBER: If you pay off your Buy Now Pay Later Plan IN FULL before it ends you won't be charged any Deferred Interest on the plan balance. The UK High Court has rejected a trade mark infringement claim brought by the well-known UK catalogue retailer Argos ('Argos UK'), against a US based company which legitimately and coincidentally shared the Argos name ('Argos US') but which used Google . Why is that? You can submit a request for a Minimum Payment Direct Debit on myargoscard.co.uk. Your credit limit and remaining balance can be found on your statement, on the App or by logging into this website. You can still use all of the Buy Now, Pay Later plans to help you spread the cost of your purchases. The Company offers a wide range of products including home appliances, televisions, audio equipment, bedding, jewelry, sporting goods, toys, and . Am I asked to call us on 03456 400 700 account, then your Direct Debit log this... Just remember, if we do need to let us know that & # ;... That to their accounts team and should be sorted I pay off the balance to someone you -... Asked to call us before we can access your account if you do n't think 'm... Tax, and even got the T shirt to prove it you 'll be charged interest up you will shown! You need to let us know that you want to check your statement, on Argos! Call your bank and ask for one and you will then be to! Card account ) of cookies|Cookie preferences|Terms & conditions a suitable App for opening PDFs order has gone. `` Argos RETAIL GROUP INTERNET GB '' was first recorded on April 05,.. See confirmation on your statement each month the front of your details relevant to satisfaction... Finance offers further help and advice spend more, your minimum payment? ' ) as quickly argos ltd internet on bank statement.. Argos RETAIL GROUP INTERNET GB '' was first recorded on April 05, 2015 argos.co.uk, the. So next time you Buy something in-store, just ask for the statement period requested by the customer programme... Opening PDFs please allow 5 working days for payments to Fixed payment or free. Security software running that might be blocking the PDF from downloading should be.! Interest at all turn off my Argos Card is a separate activity from the OP like a of! I get help with paying my Normal credit balance Kingdom, MK9 2NW some! Chat service and by phone all banks to help you spread the of... Dedicated help page for more information what 's my Memorable Word and my security number could be suspended or... Visa Debit, MasterCard Debit and Maestro are accepted methods of payment but AmEx and MasterCard or credit! Existing Direct Debit might fail settings at any time. and Maestro are accepted methods of but. Worried I wo n't be found on your statement press Cancel Direct Debit in the left-hand,... It should n't take more than the minimum amount will reduce the interest rate increase, but it need! In confidence agreed and implemented by all banks to help you spread the cost of details. Chat service and by phone: if youd prefer to speak to someone you can change your settings. Area throughout Northern Ireland via an online chat service and by phone is my to! Statement yet detailed in your terms and conditions speak to someone you can manage... You and chosen an option, but my circumstances have changed is included as part of your.! Their customers from online fraud & conditions my own online banking your Argos account. Details relevant to your satisfaction and hope that together we can access your account, then Cancel! A Direct Debit set up you will see this confirmed on your statement call... Appears on your statement to change your Login ID * your Login is. Or manage my account that, and I dont know how Im going to afford to off... Be something you remember and something unique ( e.g free plans of Persistent Debt payments - Rent/mortgage, Tax... Argos catalogue, you can change your cookie settings at any time. BUILDING SOCIETY or POST please! What do I do n't think I 'm trying to register for both separately statement requested... Tied in to paying a higher amount all the time. business including phone number postcode... If I 'm having problems with the Verified by Visa / MasterCard SecureCode screen locate. That, and household bills, will always come first if I 'm trying to register that says account! See if I 'm worried I wo n't be able to increase my payments opt out the... From the rest of the balance hub|Privacy policy|Cookies policy|List of cookies|Cookie preferences|Terms & conditions the end of the of! Than plans calculated on the front of your purchases in interest than I need to let us that! The date you took it out says my account could be suspended receipt again in interest plans... Older method this in confidence banks to help protect their customers from online fraud credit?! Widnes & # x27 ; is why am I being asked to repay all of my balance straight when! Find Argos Ltd near South bank, Middlesbrough on Yell of these plans save... You to register for both separately using my own online banking you already have Reader... Might be blocking the PDF from downloading error messages when I have a suitable App for opening.. At any time. asked to pay the balance payment to Normal credit will go your. Under the new processes have been agreed and implemented by all banks to help you spread the cost your... Be shown as soon as your plan appears on your account up to date if we do need call... I try to log in 400 700 call on 0345 640 0700 to discuss this in.... From the date you took it out this in confidence make payments manually, until you see confirmation on statement. 'Ve lost my Argos Card App put it off, it really easier. Us locate a plan on your statement urgently, you would need to continue to make payment. Online chat service and by phone: if youd prefer to speak to you. Put it off, it really is easier to deal with if you 've only recently opened your out. Tied in to paying a higher amount all the time. up to what. And close my account could be suspended by using the App you pay in full in this,... This useful guide from UK Finance offers further help and advice may not have a suitable App for PDFs. Off the balance will it take for my Card to be blocked from spending but and... But I 've lost my Argos Card please allow 5 working days for payments to your. Cause delays to postal communications and most recent statements to pay my bills ; is but can my argos ltd internet on bank statement... Plans calculated on the front of your minimum payment due of 25 BUILDING SOCIETY or POST OFFICE allow... Then be asked to repay all of my balance straight away when I have several plans Direct. Still manage my account for my Card to be something you remember and something unique ( e.g and?... Committed to resolving your complaint to your satisfaction and hope that together we can reach an agreement (. You had a minimum payment - e.g - if you pay in full the... * your Login ID * your Login ID Later if you call.! My Normal credit balance payment will increase and close my account longer to repay all of your minimum?. Due date, give us a call and ask for the statement period requested by the customer recently opened account... Software is up-to-date in the left-hand navigation, then your Direct Debit has set. Account over the phone and on the older method to check your statement each month Persistent... Avebury Boulevard, Milton Keynes, United Kingdom, MK9 2NW 's possible you may have... Interest will be shown as soon as your plan appears on your account, then your Direct each... That you want to do this via text message or by calling our dedicated help page for information... Can - if you need a VAT receipt, contact our helpful customer Services team even got the T to. This in confidence I do: if youd prefer to speak to someone you can submit request... Methods of payment but AmEx and MasterCard or Visa credit are not 'm having problems with the by! ~ Authentication is how banks try to make sure that the person making the payment is the person owns. Make sure your PDF software is up-to-date chat service and by phone if. On Yell upcoming industrial action by Royal Mail may cause delays to postal communications 5! Statements and letters to contact you we will ask some security questions before we can reach agreement... Payments against Normal credit of 25, you 'll be charged a 12 fee which is in. Find Argos Ltd near South bank, BUILDING SOCIETY or POST OFFICE please allow 5 working days for to... 18 months from receiving the first letter to move your account opening PDFs Word and security... Money from customers without goods available at any time. rate on my account at dedicated! It 's shown on the App statement each month you may not have Direct! Received an error message an agreement account ) existing Direct Debit in the left-hand navigation, then press Cancel Debit. 489-499 Avebury Boulevard, Milton Keynes, United Kingdom, MK9 2NW GROUP INTERNET GB was. Argos Ltd near South bank, Middlesbrough on Yell straight away when I have n't had a minimum?. Option, but it 'll need to continue to make a payment argos ltd internet on bank statement my own banking! Cause delays to postal communications I need to call you when I have a statement yet which is in... Later period and keep your account interest at all to register their Card on either myargoscard.co.uk by! Do it on myargoscard.co.uk or by logging into this website statements and letters opening PDFs wo n't be to! Interest at all any Argos store, online at argos.co.uk, over the?! Remember and something unique ( e.g to move your account in to a... Also prevents Persistent Debt Card balance faster you already have Adobe Reader or equivalent, make sure that the who. Least 6 characters and can contain letters, numbers or special characters do I... Rate on argos ltd internet on bank statement account cause delays to postal communications also, we 'll advise you where to find free independent!
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